Ladies, who would you like to be courted by?

[ole]

Certainly glad the unbridled lust police are paying attention. A little equal opportunity here, Miss Markie. You chastise the gentlemen while the ladies, yourself included, pruriently canoodle with bearded knights. The double standard is alive and very well, thank you.
Ole

[Miss Markie]

Dear Ole,
You were not so much being chided as reminded it is not all LOOKS that ladies are interested in.

And I am wondering so why you protest thus? Has some nerve been tweaked? I meant no harm, although I do think it ungallant to refer to all women of the Civil War era as being part of some 'pandemic of ugly' .

Please Ole, do not be wounded so. Or so angry! No slight or any negative comparison was intended. And I would never be one to police someone else's, well, um, I believe I was called the "Lust Police". Goodness, I missed THAT promotion!!

[ole]

Do not concern yourself, Dear Lady. Ole feels compelled to raise his voice occasionally for no particular reason. He understands the attraction of a lady for a gentle man -- however physically unstimulating he might be (personal experience). I also understand the attraction of a man for a fine lady of obvious goodness, in spite of her clock-stopping visage. (My father's aunts fall well within my assessment -- OK one of the four was quite attractive.)

Meanwhile, back at the thread, I notice that most of the ladies' choices include the dashing, notable figures. Who picked Grant? A solid loser in civilian life, but a devoted husband and father. Or Thomas? A rugged strong hunk? I can understand the avoidance of Sherman who provided handsomely for his family while largely keeping himself distant from it.

I didn't say all CW-era women were ugly -- just most. Julia Grant and Varina Davis, given a makeover, may well have appealed to modern standards of desirability. There's not a whole lot you could do to gild Mary Todd Lincoln or Belle Boyd.

Now that would be a project for a computer geek -- take some of those portrait photos and apply a modern touch. Just to test my conclusion. Maybe with a touch-up, they'd be more acceptable to modern standards.

Meanwhile, it remains that the ladies prefer the dashing, dangerous man as a dream beau. The men have been strangely silent.

Ole

[Miss Markie]

I am so glad I didn't offend with the somewhat silly musings we have posted here. Since this is all just that, musings, I guess a bit of shallowness is allowed.

Now as for the choices you mentioned. I think I would have a hard time with Grant's cigar smoking!! Although Miss Markie on occasion will indulge in a small, 'ladylike' cigar, it isn't daily, nor 20 a day! However, that aside, I think Ulys loved his Julia very much and was a good and indulgent husband and father. It was, however, very hard to be married to a hero, as is apparent when you read her memoirs. I was getting so depressed by her constant jealousies and complaining of this or that lady trying to catch her husband's eye, after his reaching heroic military then political status, that I could not finish the book!

George Thomas is getting a new look I think. My husband gave me the latest copy of the Smithsonian in which Thomas is referred to as "The Civil War General Cheated by History". He had a tough row to hoe, being a Virginian loyal to the Union (according to the article, his family cut him off for his 'traitorous' ways and turned his picture to the wall. His wife, southern born I would guess, stuck with him. And yes, he's a pretty good looker!

Interesting that no one picked Sherman!

A lot of these men had very 'plain' looking wives, by today's standards, and it is always important to remember that the standards for feminine beauty change on a whim, whereas the standards for handsome men seem to be unchanging. (Miss Markie here mutters something about 'typical' under her breath, but does not want to get into contention about that! )

Now if I was a techno person, I could whip up on screen a photo of some early pics of both Varina Davis, and Cordelia Harvey (first lady of Wisconsin, widowed when her husband drowned in the Tennessee River after Shiloh, founder of several hospitals) when they were younger. They were quite pretty. But again, as they aged, both women and men in the 19th c. tended to gaining weight ( a sign of middle class prosperity) and in general what we would term today as 'letting themselves go'.

I think the reason some of the fellows mentioned here look so dashing in their CW photos has a lot to do with two things: 1. They were photographed at a time when they were ACTIVE, as in getting a lot of exercise, and 2. They were in UNIFORM. Looking at Grant and Hancock, and even my beloved Robert E. Lee in civies, and after the war, they just don't look so 'dashing'. Put the skinniest, geekiest kid in a uniform and all of a sudden, boom! They look purposeful, if not dashing. I have had several former high school students come back to visit me at school after a stint in basic, and they just look like "hey, how come this kid couldn't get a prom date?"

Anyway, I am glad we are still friends, dashing Ole.

[ole]

Dashing Ole???? Dear one has been gasping for breath for an hour now, and I fear I'm going to have to sedate her.

Interesting that no one picked Sherman!

From his pictures, it's obvious that he didn't care about how he looked. (Turn off?) And I'm afraid participants with the raging libidos know too much about him to select him -- if Sherman had a smidgeon of tenderness in his body, he didn't show it. (Turn off?)

I'm unqualified to judge the attractiveness of a man so I can only speculate why the scruffy Sherman is not an object of desire. (After all, I think Brad Pitt is unattractive.) With that, I'll agree with your statement that the wormen of the day were plain, and let it go at that.

Ole

[samgrant]

Originally Posted by ole

Dashing Ole???? Dear one has been gasping for breath for an hour now, and I fear I'm going to have to sedate her. From his pictures, it's obvious that he didn't care about how he looked. (Turn off?) And I'm afraid participants with the raging libidos know too much about him to select him -- if Sherman had a smidgeon of tenderness in his body, he didn't show it. (Turn off?)

I'm unqualified to judge the attractiveness of a man so I can only speculate why the scruffy Sherman is not an object of desire. (After all, I think Brad Pitt is unattractive.) With that, I'll agree with your statement that the women of the day were plain, and let it go at that.

Ole

It's clear that you are too modest, Dashing O.

Apparently Miss M. considers you that irresistible Rhett Butler type. Why not go with it? You don't give a ****.

[custersluck13]

SAMG

I was just checkin out this thread and I got my best laugh of the day, thanks to you! I was thinkin more Billy Gibbons from ZZTop than Santa tho! LOL! I woulda just liked to party with that dude! Thanks for the laugh!...custersluck

BTW...I am suprised none of the ladies mentioned my hero, ol Custer..it was kinda the rock star of the north for a while!

[Susan Sweet]

My fellow of choice would be Cleburne . Or as some of my friends in our book discussion group say My Patrick. We all fell for him (well the women did) when we read Stonewall of the West . Poor Sue Tarleton though hearing Pat's death shouted by the newsboy as she worked in her garden. By the way the wallpaper on my cell phone is a picture of Patrick Cleburne. I showed it to Craig Symonds at a conference last year and he roar, passed it around his table to show all.

Lately I have taken another look at Hancock. He isn't bad either.

and yes Ole Dashing Ole is a good discription or Gentleman Ole . My regards to Dear One .
Susan

[Rebelchick318]

I think this is a great question and one I've thought about before. I guess I'd have to say J.E. B. Stuart. I've always wanted to be swept off my feet by a dashing cavlier on horseback.

[30th_il]

I am surprised no ladies mentioned Ben Butler!