Civil War History - "What if..." DiscussionsWhat if they had attacked instead of digging in...? What if he was in charge of the army instead...? Did you ever have a "What if..." question, and you weren't sure where to post it? Here's the place to ask these speculative questions!
difficult to say, Sam, North would still have a very good chance for victory due to the amt of excellent/competent officers that did not resign, however the achieving of victory would be a lot more painful. Southern victory a good possibility too, letting generals command and president of CSA using political acumen to win support
respectfully,
Matt
__________________ Great-Great Grand Nephew of George H. Pfau, 4th NJ Vol Infantry
We would be living in the CSA... just my first thought on the subject. Davis wasn't half the man or half the politician of Lincoln.
__________________ Few take the trouble to understand or to view the American scene with perspective. And we Americans love to find ourselves guilty of something. However, it is never I who am guilty, but those other Americans, the past or present government or the other political party. Americans almost never find other countries guilty. It is always ourselves or our fancied influence in other countries. Louis L'amour
We would be living in the CSA... just my first thought on the subject. Davis wasn't half the man or half the politician of Lincoln.
Hmmm......your extreme anti-South bigotry is showing just a bit...
"...wasn't half the man..."
This is a ridiculous statement.
Davis was cited for bravery several times during the Mexican War.
He also served in the Black Hawk War....
...as did Lincoln...who-
"...served three months...never fought in a battle..."
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They both made several mistakes in appointing generals (some of this due to political pressure).
No advantage to anyone there...
...Yet I can't imagine what would have happened to the Confederacy if they had lost
50,000 killed and wounded in a month and a half (Grant- Wilderness, Spotsylvania, Cold Harbor)
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The All-Knowing, All-Seeing, "Lincoln the Wise" is part of your Northern mythology.
Forget it.
I think the South still would have lost the war eventually, even with Lincoln as President. Manpower and resources in Dixie were so much less than were available to the North. Lincoln, as Commander in Chief of the Southern armies would make more rational, unemotional, and practical military decisions, leaving his personal feelings toward his military commanders at the door of the tent, and focusing on military ops.
But eventually he would have to see the writing on the wall and realize that his resources could not match those of the North. He would surrender when he came to that conclusion, as General Lee did, rather than prolonging the war and forcing his men to fight on for a cause that was lost.
Hmmm......your extreme anti-South bigotry is showing just a bit...
....
The All-Knowing, All-Seeing, "Lincoln the Wise" is part of your Northern mythology. Forget it.
I will; not a problem to forget things. I'm sorry I view Davis as a man who commited & formented treason. He broke so many oathes it is almost funny. He lied, cheated, stole and lacked integrity as most politicians do. If I could find one specific cause above all others of why the South was beaten... Davis. From start to finish he was an inept President. He betrayed the trust put in him by every good and brave man who served a higher cause than him. He failed his people; Lincoln didn't.
I love being called an Anti-Southern Bigot... I wish someone would explain that to my southern wife; might be amusing to watch.
I don't particularly care for politicians; Lincoln or any others. But guess what Battalion; Lincoln was heads and shoulders above most of them. But he was a man with as many failings as any other. I don't burn any incense in a shrine to the man; in fact I don't own any biographies of him nor even paticularly care to read his words. But history bears me out; Lincoln is remembered with honor. Monuments to the man reside in many places... the other is mearly a footnote in history.
Davis was cited for bravery several times... and? Your point is what? He was an officer; he did his job and got credit for the valor of his men.
Do forgive me if I refuse to inhale the incense you're burning in your Davis shrine. I don't care for Davis. As a man, as a President, as a politician in general, as a leader of men etc. He was a dismal failure at all of the above. My opinion and the last time I checked I was still allowed to have it.
__________________ Few take the trouble to understand or to view the American scene with perspective. And we Americans love to find ourselves guilty of something. However, it is never I who am guilty, but those other Americans, the past or present government or the other political party. Americans almost never find other countries guilty. It is always ourselves or our fancied influence in other countries. Louis L'amour
Gut thought here as to why the South would have won with a leader the caliber of Lincoln. Wars and battles are fought in the will; once the will to win is lost so is the war.
W/ a man like Lincoln at the helm... recognition by France and England probably w/ an intervention. Davis would have insisted on keeping West Point buddies in charge of Armies would have medled in the affairs of the Army as he did w/ the CS...
No matter how good the Army incompetant leadership will crush it.
Just my two cents
__________________ Few take the trouble to understand or to view the American scene with perspective. And we Americans love to find ourselves guilty of something. However, it is never I who am guilty, but those other Americans, the past or present government or the other political party. Americans almost never find other countries guilty. It is always ourselves or our fancied influence in other countries. Louis L'amour
Shane, many of your conclusions have considerable merit. The details could be argued a bit, but that is the spice of life. Davis was in over his head in many respects, as has been shown many times. Lincoln was a politician, that was his job, what else could be said? This war should have been fought in Congress, it would have given them something constructive to do. Yes, it thinned the population, not a bad thing overall, but painful to watch and participate in. Our country learned a few lessons from this conflict, some of them positive. Life and democracy moved slowly forward. As for me, I have northern ancestors and southern blood. Makes for an interesting trip.
Shane, many of your conclusions have considerable merit. The details could be argued a bit, but that is the spice of life. Davis was in over his head in many respects, as has been shown many times. Lincoln was a politician, that was his job, what else could be said? This war should have been fought in Congress, it would have given them something constructive to do. Yes, it thinned the population, not a bad thing overall, but painful to watch and participate in. Our country learned a few lessons from this conflict, some of them positive. Life and democracy moved slowly forward. As for me, I have northern ancestors and southern blood. Makes for an interesting trip.
Ahmen and well spoken as I have come to expect.
__________________ Few take the trouble to understand or to view the American scene with perspective. And we Americans love to find ourselves guilty of something. However, it is never I who am guilty, but those other Americans, the past or present government or the other political party. Americans almost never find other countries guilty. It is always ourselves or our fancied influence in other countries. Louis L'amour
Hey Battalion: It's ok to disagree with folks on the board here. But is it necessary to be so disagreeable ? (your post 4). You seem like an intelligent person, and well informed on the war. Why the "bite to the tongue"? C'mon man.
Terry
__________________ "In this great struggle, this form of Government and every form of human right is endangered if our enemies succeed. There is more involved in this contest than is realized by every one." Abraham Lincoln - August 18, 1864 Speech to the 164th Ohio Regiment
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