Civil War History - The South & Western TheatersCheck this forum for all South and Western Theater Questions. Included are the Western, Pacific, Trans-Mississippi, & Lower Seaboard and Gulf Approach Theaters.
The Trans-Miss. had 50,000 troops.
This number could be augmented by 10s of thousands of diehards from other departments who would trickle in by 50s and 100s over the following months.
IIRR, these Trans-Mississippi troops were melting away like water in April-May of 1865. We also see precious little indication of other Confederate forces wanting to fight and die after Lee's surrender. I think you are vastly over-estimating what was available.
Tim
__________________ "Let us, then, consider all attempts to weaken this Union, by maintaining that each state is separately and individually independent, as a species of political heresy, which can never benefit us, but may bring on us the most serious distresses."
Charles Cotesworth Pinckney of South Carolina, 1740-1824, Revolutionary War soldier, one of the authors of the US Constitution in 1787, speaking at the South Carolina Ratifying Convention in 1788.
The Trans-Miss. had 50,000 troops.
This number could be augmented by 10s of thousands of diehards from other departments who would trickle in by 50s and 100s over the following months.
Thats what J.O. Shelby thought too. He couldn't even get his full command to follow him across the Rio Grande.
And, die-hards or not, they still would rather be armed than simply dangerous.
We're talking mostly farmers here, and nearly all of them were fairly close to home. Let's see ..... What does a farmer do in April and May?
ole
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
I am also inclined to say that even in the beginning of the Rebellion, the states willing to join the Confederacy wasn't in a 'all one' joint 'merge. The states straggled into formation of the 'confederacy,' and where battles were in 'their yards--' the list here might be in of itself telling:
ALABAMA = TOTAL = 7
ARKANSAS = TOTAL = 17
COLORADO =TOTAL = 1
DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA = TOTAL = 1
FLORIDA =TOTAL = 6
GEORGIA = TOTAL = 27
IDAHO = TOTAL = 1
INDIANA = TOTAL = 1
KANSAS = TOTAL = 4
KENTUCKY = TOTAL = 11
LOUISIANA = TOTAL = 23
MARYLAND = TOTAL = 7
MINNESOTA = TOTAL = 2
MISSISSIPPI = TOTAL = 16
MISSOURI = TOTAL = 27
NEW MEXICO = TOTAL = 2
NORTH CAROLINA = TOTAL = 20
NORTH DAKOTA = TOTAL = 5
OHIO = TOTAL = 2
OKLAHOMA = TOTAL = 7
PENNSYLVANIA = TOTAL = 2
SOUTH CAROLINA = TOTAL = 11
TENNESSEE = TOTAL = 38
TEXAS = TOTAL = 5
VIRGINIA = TOTAL = 123
WEST VIRGINIA =TOTAL = 15
What the sadness is, for me -- is that many of these battles in various parts of the USA have rarely been given thought, mention and or the respect that is due-- Like, Minnesota, North Dakota, Idaho, Indiana, Colorado, etc.
But, it is evident that Virginia paid the price as far as battles on it's soil.
It did not begin the Rebellion.
So, if one feels that there are 'unimportant battles,' please look at the numbers and location. [Smiles] I know I wasn't told about battles in North Dakota, Colorado, Idaho, Indiana, Kansas, Minnesota-- These are the *Rodney Dangerfields" of the Civil War.
Just some thoughts.
Respectfully submitted for consideration,
M. E. Wolf
Note * Rodney Dangerfield, for those unfamiliar with him, was a comic who's favorite line and 'identity' was 'I don't get no respect."
Those "unknown" battles are considered CW only because they happened during the CW years. All were some rather sharp differences between Native Americans and settlers (except maybe Kansas and Indiana).
ole
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
Thats what J.O. Shelby thought too. He couldn't even get his full command to follow him across the Rio Grande.
A crossing the Rio Grande is not involved.
__________________ POWER & MONEY
"Your New-York bankers and merchants are shrewd people, but I never gave them credit for so much sagacity as when they took the Government Loan. It was not merely patriotism, it was a high stroke of policy. It has saved the Government, and what they will regard as equally important, saved them from a great financial disaster."
And, die-hards or not, they still would rather be armed than simply dangerous.
We're talking mostly farmers here, and nearly all of them were fairly close to home. Let's see ..... What does a farmer do in April and May?
ole
There were many natives of TX, AR, and LA in the AoT and ANV.
__________________ POWER & MONEY
"Your New-York bankers and merchants are shrewd people, but I never gave them credit for so much sagacity as when they took the Government Loan. It was not merely patriotism, it was a high stroke of policy. It has saved the Government, and what they will regard as equally important, saved them from a great financial disaster."
There were many natives of TX, AR, and LA in the AoT and ANV.
In April of 1865, the AoT was with Joe Johnston in North Carolina, down to a few thousand men. A large chunk were citizens of TN, AL, MS, GA. Just how many of these men are you counting on?
Lee's ANV certainly had troops from TX and LA; I don't recall AR offhand, but there were probably a few. Most of that Army came from VA and NC and other states East of the Mississippi. Lee's whole force was probably about 35,000 at Appomattox; less surrendered. Just how many of these men are you counting on?
Tim
__________________ "Let us, then, consider all attempts to weaken this Union, by maintaining that each state is separately and individually independent, as a species of political heresy, which can never benefit us, but may bring on us the most serious distresses."
Charles Cotesworth Pinckney of South Carolina, 1740-1824, Revolutionary War soldier, one of the authors of the US Constitution in 1787, speaking at the South Carolina Ratifying Convention in 1788.
There were many natives of TX, AR, [MO] and LA in the AoT and ANV.
Yes, there were, but what is the composition of troops in the Trans-Mississippi? It is my contention that any force Davis could have formed to cross into Mexico would come from these. I consider it highly unlikely that many Trans-Missippi soldiers in the AoT and AoNV wanted an extension of the nine month's they'd just been through.
Quote:
A crossing the Rio Grande is not involved.
It isn't? How else does one get to Mexico? What were Jo Shelby's plans? (Cue Borderruffian.)
ole
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
Yes, there were, but what is the composition of troops in the Trans-Mississippi? It is my contention that any force Davis could have formed to cross into Mexico would come from these. I consider it highly unlikely that many Trans-Missippi soldiers in the AoT and AoNV wanted an extension of the nine month's they'd just been through.It isn't? How else does one get to Mexico? What were Jo Shelby's plans? (Cue Borderruffian.)
ole
Who said they were going to Mexico?
An alliance with France (Maximillian and Mexico) does not require going into Mexico.
__________________ POWER & MONEY
"Your New-York bankers and merchants are shrewd people, but I never gave them credit for so much sagacity as when they took the Government Loan. It was not merely patriotism, it was a high stroke of policy. It has saved the Government, and what they will regard as equally important, saved them from a great financial disaster."
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