Civil War History - The South & Western TheatersCheck this forum for all South and Western Theater Questions. Included are the Western, Pacific, Trans-Mississippi, & Lower Seaboard and Gulf Approach Theaters.
You may want to take a look at Shelby Foote's "Shiloh: A Novel" (222 pages). It's an excellent description of the battle, including the Hornet's Nest. It includes a map that, in addition to depicting the Hornet's Nest in relation to the other areas, briefly describes the different events of the battle.
You also want to read "Shiloh, The Battle that Changed the Civil War", by Larry Daniel. Covers the Hornets Nest quite well, and excellent job for both days in the Bloody Pond area.
Less on the Hornets Nest specifically, and more on the men doing the fighing would beg reading "Seeing the Elephant" Raw Recruits at the Battle of Shiloh" by Joseph Allan Frank and George A. Reaves.
I spent 3 1/2 days at Shiloh and was lucky to spend about 30 mins talking with Stacy Allen, the site Historian. Most of the time was spent discussing the Hornets Nest, the balance on Shermans position.
Chuck in IL.
You may have forgotten your original posting, but I'd like to jump in with a few.
The Hornet's Nest made good copy. And it was not unimportant on that first day. But it was not so important as popular history has made it.
Consider: Grant ordered that Confederate dead be buried where they died. There is no gravesite anywhere near the Nest. The Nest was not overrun, it was surrounded. Stand in that spot today. If they have kept it anywhere near what it was, no sane man would have attacked it as the books have it.
Next, separate the actions in the area. They were not all the same. The Peach Orchard, the Sunken Road, Bloody Pond, were all in the same area but can more easily be understood if they are considered separately from the Nest.
Bad time in the battle. Impossible odds. But little of it conforms to popular history.
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
You also want to read "Shiloh, The Battle that Changed the Civil War", by Larry Daniel. Covers the Hornets Nest quite well, and excellent job for both days in the Bloody Pond area.
Less on the Hornets Nest specifically, and more on the men doing the fighing would beg reading "Seeing the Elephant" Raw Recruits at the Battle of Shiloh" by Joseph Allan Frank and George A. Reaves.
I spent 3 1/2 days at Shiloh and was lucky to spend about 30 mins talking with Stacy Allen, the site Historian. Most of the time was spent discussing the Hornets Nest, the balance on Shermans position.
Chuck in IL.
Chuck,
A bit down the line from your first post on this but how does history and your park historian view the performance of Gen Prentiss and his sturdy 6th division. Among the unsung heroes allowing Grant to fight another day?
Respecfully,
Spartan
A bit down the line from your first post on this but how does history and your park historian view the performance of Gen Prentiss and his sturdy 6th division. Among the unsung heroes allowing Grant to fight another day?
At last! Someone who wants to renew discussion of an actual battle!
For one, and I forget the numbers, but those fighting "with" Prentiss were not all his -- a goodly portion of that unhappy, beset group were from Hurlburt and Wallace's troops. As was mentioned earlier, their misfortune was to be surrounded.
It must be recognized that Prentiss was in the middle of "holding at all hazards." This is the Prentiss who bore the brunt of the "surprise" and was ready to cashier Peabody for bringing on a general engagement (read, first discovering the impending Confederate advance).
As I recolllect (by the way, I was with mobile_96), little mention was made of Prentiss' stand -- it was more on the lines of the Union Troops' stand.
Once Stacy realized he wasn't talking to tourists, he warmed up and talked way longer than I could have expected. Had some interesting theories on the battle, at least one of which I'd never heard before and haven't heard since -- that one being that Beauregard/Johnston expected the Federals to be lined up, north to south, and facing west. Another is the lack of burial trenches. As noted earlier, Grant ordered the dead to be buried where they fell, hence the trenches near where the heaviest slaughters occurred. No trenches in the face of the Peach Orchard, Sunken Road or Hornet's nest. Why not? The simplest explanation is that fighting was not so heavy in those areas as history would have us believe -- multiple charges, heavy casualties, terrible slaughter might well have been told out of proportion.
But that wasn't your question was it? Forgive, please. I get excited when anyone mentions Shiloh/Pittsburg Landing. You been there yet? Make it a point to do it before your legs and stamina give out. You can drive to the major points, but there is so much more to see than you can from the parking areas.
Ole
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
Though Prentiss position contained elements of Hurlbut and Wallace, I think the main body of Hurlbut was positioned at the Peach Orchard wasn't it Ole? I believe it was Hurlbut's skeddadle that began the rapid rout followed by Wallace. If I recall it was really terrain and Confederate confusion and disorder that even allowed Prentiss the opportunity to hold "at all hazards" for a long as they did was it not?
I dont know much about Prentiss beyond Shiloh, was he and the western Federals captured promptly paroled and what became of the General?
Respectfully,
Spartan
Quick reply, Spartan, will have to look it up tonight. If I'm recalling correctly, Prentiss surrendered more of Wallace's troops than he did his own. The terrain did serve the Yanks well. The Reb's had to cross open fields. The Yanks had a nice gully behind their position where some of them could, in rotation, clean their weapons, eat a cracker and take a breath. Confederate confusion? Perhaps, in terms of who was in charge of whom. Personally, I'd have had a great deal of trouble charging across that open field against an enemy I couldn't see, but who had no trouble seeing me.
Am also questioning the use of "skedaddle." Prentiss' left was flanked just east of the Bloody Pond/Peach Orchard area. Prentiss' right took a look at Ruggles' line and got out of Dodge -- in effect, they were in a hopeless position.
On Prentiss. He was exchanged in October, 1862. He served on the court-marshal of Fitz John Porter and made MJ 3/13/63 to date from 11/29/62. At the time, he was commanding the District of Eastern Arkansas with headquarters at Helena. His resignation was accepted on October 28, 1863, perhaps because he felt he had been shelved, but officially because of "health and the situation of his family."
Will check into this more, later.
Ole
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
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