Civil War History - Secession and PoliticsWas it Slavery, or was it States Rights? Perhaps it was the election of Lincoln? What were the real reasons for Southern Secession and what were the political issues in this time of war? Find your answers here in the Secession and Politics Disussion.
you mean apart from the SC cases i gave?, apart from Scotus makeing it clear the slave was not a part of the body politic inD Scott and other cases,, apart from each states constion, most preventing free slaves the right to vote, give evidence in court, be aparty to a contract, apart from how madison explained the relationship of the slave in society, apart from the naturlization acyt that made only white able to be citizens, along with state constions that made only whites able to be ciotizens of states?, apart from teh lkaws preventing slaves from even being in Congres, carrying federal mail or holding federal office?, or do you mean how USA education books expalin how slavery was protected in the constition?, in which case all you need do is find the required reading list and read for yourself.
__________________ "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote."
Benjamin Franklin, 1759
It is interesting that the Civil War destroyed slavery and not the states. Could it be that the 'only' states right that really mattered, was slavery?
Other historians have noted, that almost everyone in America at the time, thought they were fighting to restore a pristine Past, when they wre actually engaged in a great struggle to advance into the future.
It is interesting that the Civil War destroyed slavery and not the states. Could it be that the 'only' states right that really mattered, was slavery?
Not acording to the historical record, the CSA states were denied represtation in congress under reconstruction and rulled under international laws of war that made them occupied territorys, excatly as is tibet today.
the WBTS did not destroy slavery, the individual states eneded slavery, and together all the states amended the constition to end slavery in an open amendment, so the idea that slaverys death was a war aim is incorrect, Congress went to war, specificly makeing clear it was not doing so to interfre with slavery, and the EP and pres was very clear, as a war measure to win the mil conflict, slavery become an object of the war as a war measure, in teh same way the US did not goto war to end the practice of putting people in oven the nazi did not like, but become a war aim.
Quote:
Other historians have noted, that almost everyone in America at the time, thought they were fighting to restore a pristine Past, when they wre actually engaged in a great struggle to advance into the future.
Since slavery predates the Union, the AoC and the Uk colonies introduce it as soon as practible, the french in La, Texas, and other also, and these regions were joined to the Union with express aceptence of perpetual slavery, its not clear any historian is refering to anything factual, ie slavery was the USA pristine past.
If everyone thought as you posisted, then the whole slavery thing would not have existed, clearly it did.
__________________ "Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch.
Liberty is a well armed lamb contesting the vote."
Benjamin Franklin, 1759
so the idea that slaverys death was a war aim is incorrect, Congress went to war, specificly makeing clear it was not doing so to interfre with slavery, and the EP and pres was very clear, as a war measure to win the mil conflict, slavery become an object of the war as a war measure, in teh same way the US did not goto war to end the practice of putting people in oven the nazi did not like, but become a war aim.
Lincoln has to placate the pro-slave unionists in the border states. So What?
Hanny's history is murky as ever.
Every thing, Lincoln was compelled to do, to win the war would not be undone to secure peace. Lincoln's rock-bottom minimum requirement to end the war was Reunion And (not, either/or) the End of slavery.
It is illogical and unhistorical to believe that emancipation was not a war aim.
In Lincoln's eyes, as political leader and Commander in Chief, slavery was the root cause of the War. The war and slavery were inseparable, To eliminate one, the other, also, had to be eliminated.
Slavery was America's pristine past and as I noted, the War, was a step 'away' from the past and a 'step' into the future; Without Slavery.
P.S. The past seen by the majority of northerners. was the past where slavery was safely penned up in the south on the road to extinction.
Frederick Douglass was not fleeing from a charge of treason, but enforcement of the fugitive slave act. The institution he wanted to destroy was slavery, not the Constitution.
Hanny's history is murky as ever.
Every thing, Lincoln was compelled to do, to win the war would not be undone to secure peace. Lincoln's rock-bottom minimum requirement to end the war was Reunion And (not, either/or) the End of slavery.
It is illogical and unhistorical to believe that emancipation was not a war aim.
In Lincoln's eyes, as political leader and Commander in Chief, slavery was the root cause of the War. The war and slavery were inseparable, To eliminate one, the other, also, had to be eliminated.
Slavery was America's pristine past and as I noted, the War, was a step 'away' from the past and a 'step' into the future; Without Slavery.
P.S. The past seen by the majority of northerners. was the past where slavery was safely penned up in the south on the road to extinction.
.
I somewhat diagree. In Catton's book, Grant Moves South, he talks about the fact that for the average soldier in the West, the war was not, at first, about slavery. Indeed, he was content to leave slavery be. It was only after he spent time in the South, seeing what the slaveholding areas were like, that he decided that in order to win the war, it was necessary to destroy slavery. Upon until this point, "abolitionist" was seen by the common soldier as a dirty word. He notes that the abolitionist Wendell Phillips was modded at the Opera House in Cinncinnati where he was speaking and pelted with stones and eggs.
"Sentiment with regard to the Negro himself had not changed; what was rising was a cold fury with secession and secessionists..." Id. at p. 295.
He quotes Brigadier General James Garfield that a conviction grew among the Union soldiers that "behind the Rebel army of soldiers, the black army of laborers was feeding and sustained the rebellion and there could be no victory until its main support was taken away." Id.
I am inclined to accept Lincoln at his word that at the start of the war, he had no intention to end slavery where it existed. He was only interested in stopping its spread. It certainly appears that the aim of the common soldier was not to end slavery but to restore the Union. However, it became clear to Lincoln, as it became clear to the common soldier, that to win the war required that the war end slavery - the prop that supported the Confederate cause. Certanly the political climate at the start of the war in the North would not allow the abolition of slavery as a stated war aim. After the soldiers saw the effects of slavery first hand, however, and communicated their views to the "folks back home" it became not only possible but perhaps inevitable that the war became one to end slavery.
__________________ "There must be more historians of the Civil War than there were generals figthing in it... Of the two groups, the historians are the more belligerent." David Donald, Lincoln Reconsidered (1961)
"After the soldiers saw the effects of slavery first hand, however, and communicated their views to the "folks back home" it became not only possible but perhaps inevitable that the war became one to end slavery."
I believe that was only true perhaps to a point, say the first couple of years of the war. After that it was more like a bar room brawl - fighting for the sake of the fight and survival. I suspect far more soldiers than not, from the Union perspective, never lost sight of the goal of restoring or rather preserving the union. Slavery, like the slaves, weren't of paramount importance to the common soldier. Many among the scholars on this board don't agree with that. I've been wrong before, but I haven't given up on this notion.
__________________ Ancestors in US Army: 13th TN Cav; 10th TN Cav; 3rd NC Inf
Ancestors in CSA Army: 48th VA; 63rd VA, 5th NC Cav; 37th NC
Wife and Grandson's CSA: 15th AL, 51st GA, 41st TN; 36th TN; GA Mil 1197 Dist
CivilWarTalk.com -
A free and friendly Civil War community. 
What? 
Linear Mode
