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Civil War History - Secession and Politics Was it Slavery, or was it States Rights? Perhaps it was the election of Lincoln? What were the real reasons for Southern Secession and what were the political issues in this time of war? Find your answers here in the Secession and Politics Disussion.

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  #41  
Old 01-06-2008, 10:15 PM
larry_cockerham's Avatar
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While I'm thinking about it, would one of you younger gentlemen please tell me how to quote a single line rather than the entire post?
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  #42  
Old 01-06-2008, 10:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry_cockerham View Post
Sincerity and accuracy; two different things.
He's missing one. The jury's out on whether or not he's missing both.

Regards,
Cash
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  #43  
Old 01-06-2008, 11:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by larry_cockerham View Post
While I'm thinking about it, would one of you younger gentlemen please tell me how to quote a single line rather than the entire post?
Uh, just put your cursor into the text between the bracketed QUOTE portions and delete what you don't want.

The beginning bracketed QUOTE looks like this: [QUOTE= with the name of who is being quoted followed by a closed bracket.

The end bracketed QUOTE has a slash before the word QUOTE within the brackets. These must be retained.

Regards,
Cash
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  #44  
Old 01-07-2008, 01:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ole View Post
Who was it who said "confederate legends" is on the T-shirt. My eyes don't generally get into that detail. But if it is presented as a legend, I have no more objection.
ole
You should keep on objecting, even while you get your prescription checked out. "Legends of the Confederacy" is in large print at the top of the artwork, but I think their intended use of the word does not translate to "myths."

Cedarstripper
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  #45  
Old 01-07-2008, 03:07 AM
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ole ole is offline
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Quote:
While I'm thinking about it, would one of you younger gentlemen please tell me how to quote a single line rather than the entire post?
Larry, if you don't mind an elder observation: highlight what you want to quote; right click and select copy; left click the quick reply icon; left click your cursor in the box and right click and select paste. Voila. Then you can highlight the line again and left click the "quote" icon.

Doing that gets you this. But if you do it Cash's way, you get the emoticons. My way, you don't, unless you "go advanced." Better you should just ask your grandson to show you how.

ole
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Last edited by ole; 01-07-2008 at 03:10 AM.
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  #46  
Old 01-13-2008, 11:09 AM
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Clara's original question asked about the efficiency of slavery vs. free labor, among other things. I've recently finished another book by Gavin Wright that touches on the issue.

Wright argues that economic evidence on the efficiency of American slavery, as a labor system, is inconclusive. One the one hand, there is little evidence demonstrating that slavery was less efficient than free labor. On the other hand, the evidence for economies of scale due to gang labor (the basis for most such claims) is also iffy at best.

Wright argues that slavery's advantages lay elsewhere. American slavery was not simply a system of labor organization. It was also a set of property rights. It was the property rights aspect of slavery that made slavery tremendously attractive and perpetuating.

Before the War, slaves constituted, by far, the single most valuable category of non-real property in the United States. Unlike real property, slave property was transportable. The characteristics of slave property meant there could be a region-wide market (wherever slavery was legal), giving slaveholders ready access to credit.

Looking at settlement patterns in the North and South, what is distinctive is that northern territories developed slowly at first, as immigrants gradually moved in from the East, generally buying small plots that they could afford to purchase from savings. In the South, however, when new territory opened up for settlement, existing slaveholders were generally able to use agents and credit to buy larger pieces of the best land. Even without moving there, existing slaveholder could then arrange for the transfer of existing slaves there, or the purchase of new slaves (more credit), to clear and begin planting. In short, slavery gave owners the ability to quickly take advantage of economic opportunities in distant and even otherwise undesirable locations.

Second, the property aspects of slavery allowed owners to allocate slave labor as they wished (with some exceptions, eg, Sundays off), and not in accordance with the wishes of the slaves. For example, slave women often worked in the fields. White plain folk women may have done so occasionally (see Stephanie McCurry), but certainly the hope and expectation was that they would do domestic chores. In short, "Slaveowners could reallocate family labor from household or nonmarket activities into cash crops, using profitiablity criteria."

Third, in the north, employment at will quickly became the rule, which meant that free labor could leave at any time. The property aspects of slavery meant that slaveowners could be sure that their labor was captive and would be available at peak periods. This meant that slaveowners could plant increased amounts of cash crops. This allowed slaveowners to maximize returns, particularly in exceptional crop years like 1859.

If you figure in the value of wealth represented by slaves themselves, the south was just as wealthy as the north in 1860. The wealth manifested itself in different ways, of course (basically slaves vs. land), and slavery had all sorts of ramifications (on land settlement patterns, tool usage, schools) that amounted to hidden liabilities, but that is another story.

To recap, Wright argues that "productivity" is a red herring. Whether slaves sowed or reaped a field as efficiently as free workers was only a very small part of the reason that slavery was or was not attractive as an economic matter.

Amazon.com: Slavery And American Economic Development (Walter Lynwood Fleming Lectures in Southern History): Books: Gavin Wright
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  #47  
Old 01-14-2008, 10:13 AM
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I love how people claim 100,000 or so black confederates served, but when producing evidence the largest group they have all at once is always the same one.. the LA natiive gaurd... and the same 65 men riding cavalry, and then or or two here or there. And almost every sight claiming these reads almost word for word from the original source, nobody making their own reserach or passing their own judgement. Seems to me if there were 100,000 they would be in much larger gruops then these, and seen more often. But I forgot... we who do not believe in the numbers are the blind ones...

As far as Edgerton... everybody needs something to believe in, but by perpetuating the lie he is merley giving black youths a false sense of belonging based on misleading facts. That is not good for anybody, and only jumbles hsitory more. All these young blacks will never know what raelly happend, taking his words for truth. Sincerity? That does not give you a license to spread myth.
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