Civil War History - Gettysburg ForumGettysburg! It's not just a National Park. It's a Civil War Battlefield. For some it's historic and storied past are almost an obsession! All related discussions are welcome here!
Some students and historians never consider that Gen. R.E. Lee ever made any errors, or marched his army into Pennsylvania without adequate supplies.
Even Lee stated he had inadequate supplies on the first day in Adams County, forcing him to attack the Union lines, instead of waiting for an attack at Gettysburg.
Lee moved his army north, with inadequate supplies in the early summer. In Pennsylvania the harvest time for corn was in the fall, and the heavy rain in recent weeks, surely had reduced the amount of wheat and hay in the farmer's barns.
Lee had inadequate amounts of horseshoes, as a supply had mistakenly been misdirected on rail cars in Virginia.
Many soldiers in Lee's army had no shoes, and this would affect the fighting ability of his troops.
Cavalry General Buford made two observations when blocking two Confederate Corps from coming quickly down the Chambersburg-Gettysburg Pike. One was the Confederates, Early's division, had taken all the horseshoes and nails in Gettysburg, some days earlier. The other was the lack of forage in Gettysburg for Buford's own horses. What would happen when the Confederates arrived with their thousands of horses?
Lee was marching into Adams County, where he would find inadequate supplies for a large army.
Meade had a railroad supply base just to the southeast in Westminster, Maryland.
Gettysburg was a great place to wear the Confederate army down, making an eventually retreat to Virginia, inevitable.
No historian, I've read, ever faulted Lee for crossing two whole corps, Hill and Longstreet over the narrow Chambersburg-Gettysburg Pike to Gettysburg.
Of course on June 30th, Lee saw no problem. But one day later, Lee saw a great problem. He could not await attack. He had to attack, no matter how many corps were on Cemetery ridge on July 2. On June 30th supply did not seem a problem for Lee and the Army of Northern Virginia. But a day later, it was a problem. So much so, that Lee had to limit his tactics to attack. And the Army of Northern Virginia paid severely on July 2 and 3rd for a situation seen by Lee on July 1, but not on June 30th.
Lee said so much in his Gettysburg OR.
"At the same time we were unable to await an attack, as the country was unfavorable for collecting supplies in the presence of the enemy, who could re-strain our foraging parties by holding the mountain passes with local and other troops."
R.E. Lee never saw that problem before Hill was blocked by Buford outside Gettysburg.
And no historian seemed to notice. None that I recall reading.
So much so, that Lee had to limit his tactics to attack. And the Army of Northern Virginia paid severely on July 2 and 3rd for a situation seen by Lee on July 1, but not on June 30th.
Its a good point regarding the Confederate supply situation. My read on Lee is that he is offensive minded and that he's already made up his mind that he is going to attack. The fact that he is limited to the attack is almost beside the point.
Unfortunately, Lee was always above mistake to most historians.
Lee found himself in a position where he had to attack at Gettysburg. He found that he did not have the supplies to await an attack. He also found that the Army of the Potomac was present and blocking any egress towards Washington, or even to Virginia, except back over the Chambersburg-Gettysburg Pike.
Few recognize that the Union army knew the situation of defending at Gettysburg, because spies and scouts operating out of Gettysburg, were working for the Union army prior to the battle.
Northerners knew the ground at Gettysburg; Lee did not.
Lee moves two corps over the slow Chambersburg Gettysburg Pike and discovers he has a serious problem. He's in a bottle neck and cannot wait until Meade gets all his corps up to Gettysburg. Lee is in a tactical disadvantage.
In Robert E. Lee's own words in his Gettysburg report, ..."but coming unexpectedly upon the whole Fed-eral Army, to withdraw through the mountains with our extensive trains would have been difficult and dangerous."
Clearly Lee recognized his egress problems away from Gettysburg
Last edited by whitworth : 09-21-2007 at 07:56 AM.
Early's entire division and Lige White's cavalry escort went through Gettysburg and it's environs on June 26th while on the way to York county and the Susquehanna River.
How can you claim that Lee was blind?
Are you saying that Lee made a blunder on July 1?
*****Also,
Two Corps and Johnson's Division on the Cashtown Pike.
Early's entire division and Lige White's cavalry escort went through Gettysburg and it's environs on June 26th while on the way to York county and the Susquehanna River. How can you claim that Lee was blind?
We might consider that all those guys went through Gettysburg, was there any communication with Lee? If there was none, it may well be that Lee remained blind. And, we might also consider that Early had no knowledge of Meade's movements, even if he maintained contact with Lee.
Lee learned where Meade was just a bit too late to revise his plans. He figured to be well past Gettysburg, before the AotP showed up. The battle he expected was not on the ground of his choosing--which was what I think he had planned for.
Just a thought.
ole
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
We might consider that all those guys went through Gettysburg, was there any communication with Lee? If there was none, it may well be that Lee remained blind. And, we might also consider that Early had no knowledge of Meade's movements, even if he maintained contact with Lee.
Lee learned where Meade was just a bit too late to revise his plans. He figured to be well past Gettysburg, before the AotP showed up. The battle he expected was not on the ground of his choosing--which was what I think he had planned for.
Just a thought.
ole
Didn't Lee reconnoiter in 1862 during the Antietam campaign? I could swear that I remember that he sent scouts up towards the Susquehanna in the prior year. I'm not a big fan of the 'Jeb Stuart was lost' - Lee was blind thesis
Didn't Lee reconnoiter in 1862 during the Antietam campaign? I could swear that I remember that he sent scouts up towards the Susquehanna in the prior year. I'm not a big fan of the 'Jeb Stuart was lost' - Lee was blind thesis
If he did, which I'm not sure of, that only helps in a very limited way. Now he knows the terrain, possibly has a map of the area or what not... But when moving a large army through enemy territory there are slightly more important things then what the terrain looks like, and that is where is the enemy? I thought it was pretty clear that Lee was surpised with how close the union army really was. Otherwise he would have turned around sooner, and had his army consolidated on ground of HIS choosing (his plan all along) and force Meade to do the attacking. Was it all Stuarts fault tho? I don't beleive so. I beleive Lee relied too heavily on his cavalry and was afraid to move without them, he could have found an alternate mode of scouting to get a clearer picture if he wasn't so reliant on Stuart.
__________________
"In mortal combat, a man may and will become so infuriated by the din and dangers of a bloody fight that his heart will turn to stone and his every de sire [be] for blood."
John Hadley, 7th Indiana after the battle at Port Republic
"Are you saying that Lee made a blunder on July 1"?
Yes and he admits it in his Gettysburg OR. On July 1, he realized what he didn't know on June 30. He had serious supply problems, forage problems and egress out of Gettysburg. He had those problems because he brought his three corps to Gettysburg.
Of course I have doubts many historians read Lee's reports or understood what he was saying.
Lee should have had two important sources of information on Gettysburg. General Early and his staff were in Gettysburg days before the battle and noticed nothing of importance to warn Lee about.
General Trimble was the resident expert of railroads in the area and somehow neglected to tell Lee about Adams County.
Adams County was a sparcely populated county in an area fairly close to Philadelphia and areas settled long before the Revolutionary War. The populations of the counties in the area, reflected the natural resources available to support the population.
Adams County had a very limited amount of water available, few farms to find forage, and not the place to bring 70,000 soldiers and all those wagons and horses.
That was Lee's blunder and those who could have served him better, especially Jubal Early. Jubal Early, the most outspoken Confederate, who said James Longstreet had failed Lee at Gettysburg.
Anyone who doubts what I say about water, find out where the modern town of Gettysburg gets its water, and how it gets its water. If you visit, ask to see the huge reservoir serving Gettysburg.
You may have studied Gettysburg for years. But if you never studied water , you were severely shortchanged.
Last edited by whitworth : 09-22-2007 at 12:39 PM.
I'm not a big fan of the 'Jeb Stuart was lost' - Lee was blind thesis
Nor am I, if for no other reason than that it was originally part of blaming the Gettysburg calamity on anyone but Lee.
ole
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
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