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Freddy: "Sick individual"? What's sicker about killing someone with a sword as opposed to a gun?
Bloody Kansas was a mess and Brown certainly was part of it. But deeming him somehow unusual for that and ignoring everyone else that spilled blood is grossly unfair.
__________________ Do your duty in all things. You cannot do more, you should never wish to do less. - Robert E. Lee
The probability that we may fail in the struggle ought not to deter us from the support of a cause we believe to be just. - Abraham Lincoln
Slavery was in no way going to die out on its own in the US.
From the Georgia Constitution of 1861: "The General Assembly shall have no power to pass laws for the emancipation of slaves." (This is the entire text of Article 2, Sec. VII, Paragraph 3.)
From the Alabama Constitution of 1861: "No slave in this State shall be emancipated by any act done to take effect in this State, or any other country." (This is the entire text of Article IV, Section 1 (on slavery).)
HOW was slavery to die out in this country with such laws on the books in most Southern states at the time?
What effort, before the Civil War, was being taken by Southern States or leaders that would give the impression that slavery was going anywhere but as a permanent feature in American social and political life?
NONE.
Unionblue
__________________ "The American people and the Government at Washington may refuse to recognize it for a time but the inexorable logic of events will force it upon them in the end; that the war now being waged in this land is a war for and against slavery." Frederick Douglass
"Loyalty to our ancestors does not include loyalty to their mistakes." George Santayana
Slavery was in no way going to die out on its own in the US.
From the Georgia Constitution of 1861: "The General Assembly shall have no power to pass laws for the emancipation of slaves." (This is the entire text of Article 2, Sec. VII, Paragraph 3.)
From the Alabama Constitution of 1861: "No slave in this State shall be emancipated by any act done to take effect in this State, or any other country." (This is the entire text of Article IV, Section 1 (on slavery).)
HOW was slavery to die out in this country with such laws on the books in most Southern states at the time?
What effort, before the Civil War, was being taken by Southern States or leaders that would give the impression that slavery was going anywhere but as a permanent feature in American social and political life?
NONE.
Unionblue
You forget that slavery was legal in the union Constitution, don't you? I think it was the 13th amendment that put a stop to it in the latter part of 1865 which was also voted on by the South.
You forget that slavery was legal in the union Constitution, don't you? I think it was the 13th amendment that put a stop to it in the latter part of 1865 which was also voted on by the South.
Vareb,
Actually, I don't.
But the simple fact remains, that without a Civil War lasting four terrible years, costing over 620,000 lives, slavery would still be a viable, thriving institution to this present day.
In other words, it would not have died out, it would not have been gotten rid of by peaceful means, nor would there had been any effort by law or by custom in the South to rid itself of the institution.
It took four years of bloody war to force it from this nation and then change the US Constitution to abolish slavery, which, as you have already observed, then voted on abolishing it.
Unionblue
__________________ "The American people and the Government at Washington may refuse to recognize it for a time but the inexorable logic of events will force it upon them in the end; that the war now being waged in this land is a war for and against slavery." Frederick Douglass
"Loyalty to our ancestors does not include loyalty to their mistakes." George Santayana
But the simple fact remains, that without a Civil War lasting four terrible years, costing over 620,000 lives, slavery would still be a viable, thriving institution to this present day.
In other words, it would not have died out, it would not have been gotten rid of by peaceful means, nor would there had been any effort by law or by custom in the South to rid itself of the institution.
It took four years of bloody war to force it from this nation and then change the US Constitution to abolish slavery, which, as you have already observed, then voted on abolishing it.
Unionblue
My noble friend, I would like to respectively disagree. Please see my recent posts in the Mason Dixon forum. Slavery was dying, albeit a far too slow death. It took time for these new 'immigrants' to be merged with the existing society. The war, yes, accelerated a much too slow process, but it was a process already in motion, such as it was.
__________________ Ancestors in US Army: 13th TN Cav; 10th TN Cav; 3rd NC Inf
Ancestors in CSA Army: 48th VA; 63rd VA, 5th NC Cav; 37th NC
Wife and Grandson's CSA: 15th AL, 51st GA, 41st TN; 36th TN; GA Mil 1197 Dist
My noble friend, I would like to respectively disagree. Please see my recent posts in the Mason Dixon forum. Slavery was dying, albeit a far too slow death. It took time for these new 'immigrants' to be merged with the existing society. The war, yes, accelerated a much too slow process, but it was a process already in motion, such as it was.
Larry,
No, it was not, nor was there ANY evidence to point to that it was.
The process was not only "much to slow" and not "already in motion" it was at a social and political standstill.
I would be happy to be proven wrong.
Unionblue
__________________ "The American people and the Government at Washington may refuse to recognize it for a time but the inexorable logic of events will force it upon them in the end; that the war now being waged in this land is a war for and against slavery." Frederick Douglass
"Loyalty to our ancestors does not include loyalty to their mistakes." George Santayana
But the simple fact remains, that without a Civil War lasting four terrible years, costing over 620,000 lives, slavery would still be a viable, thriving institution to this present day.
In other words, it would not have died out, it would not have been gotten rid of by peaceful means, nor would there had been any effort by law or by custom in the South to rid itself of the institution.
It took four years of bloody war to force it from this nation and then change the US Constitution to abolish slavery, which, as you have already observed, then voted on abolishing it.
From the Georgia Constitution of 1861: "The General Assembly shall have no power to pass laws for the emancipation of slaves." (This is the entire text of Article 2, Sec. VII, Paragraph 3.)
From the Alabama Constitution of 1861: "No slave in this State shall be emancipated by any act done to take effect in this State, or any other country." (This is the entire text of Article IV, Section 1 (on slavery).)
__________________ Few take the trouble to understand or to view the American scene with perspective. And we Americans love to find ourselves guilty of something. However, it is never I who am guilty, but those other Americans, the past or present government or the other political party. Americans almost never find other countries guilty. It is always ourselves or our fancied influence in other countries. Louis L'amour
From the Georgia Constitution of 1861: "The General Assembly shall have no power to pass laws for the emancipation of slaves." (This is the entire text of Article 2, Sec. VII, Paragraph 3.)
From the Alabama Constitution of 1861: "No slave in this State shall be emancipated by any act done to take effect in this State, or any other country." (This is the entire text of Article IV, Section 1 (on slavery).)
States have been known to establish new constitutions on occasion.
__________________ POWER & MONEY
"Your New-York bankers and merchants are shrewd people, but I never gave them credit for so much sagacity as when they took the Government Loan. It was not merely patriotism, it was a high stroke of policy. It has saved the Government, and what they will regard as equally important, saved them from a great financial disaster."
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