Black Confederates

[johan_steele]

Battalion, you've given a number before. Oddly, it wasn't all that out of line less than the 13,000 number posted by many IIRC. Care to repost it?

[gary]

Originally Posted by Battalion

The men I have listed are Free Blacks...not Slaves.

Not in dispute. However, they served under Union colors and cannot be considered as Confederate soldiers.

Originally Posted by Hanny

54th Mass came back with negro prisoner captured bearing arms and killing yankees with it.

I too have found incidents of Confederate negro prisoners who were captured bearing arms against the Union forces. That they were engaged in combat does not mean they served as soldiers though. This was explained in my article published by The Company of Military Historians. Contact them, ask for a complimentary copy and if you like it, gwine. I've got three more articles that will be published by them and am working on a fourth.

[Hanny]

Originally Posted by Battalion

The purpose of my last several posts was to show there were Black Confederate Soldiers...not just servants attached to the army.

Most were in non-combat roles but there also appear many who were enlisted/mustered-in as private.

Next question is- How many free blacks were in the Confederate army?

1,000?

5,000?

10,000?

Not an easy one, 30 years ago the very idea would not even had occured.

Black Confedertates lost historical identity by Robert Harrison came up with 65k, of which 13k saw combat, he is negro decendednt of one who saw combat. I think it possible a little on the high side, but you pays your money and takes your choice.

We do know the age and number of free blacks of mil age in the south, its maths answer to a political question, but you can use the AWI numbers of negros who jopned the UK for freedom as a % of total, along with WBTS Northern use of negros, free and slave to get a number value of what the CSA may have had. Not a very pretty solution and one of probale little weight, but it might be usfull.

[Battalion]

"The men I have listed are Free Blacks...not Slaves."

Originally Posted by gary

Not in dispute. However, they served under Union colors and cannot be considered as Confederate soldiers.

So what you are saying is Jackson was a slave(?)-

James H. Jackson
Company C, 2nd North Carolina Artillery Regiment (Confederate)
Mustered-in as Bugler 15 August 1861
Described on roll as "colored."
Discharged for physical disability 16 January 1864.

[gary]

Originally Posted by Battalion

"The men I have listed are Free Blacks...not Slaves."



So what you are saying is Jackson was a slave(?)-

James H. Jackson
Company C, 2nd North Carolina Artillery Regiment (Confederate)
Mustered-in as Bugler 15 August 1861
Described on roll as "colored."
Discharged for physical disability 16 January 1864.

I don't know whether the James H. Jackson, a colored man who was mustered in as a musician was either a slave or a free man. I will say that he wasn't viewed by the Confederates as a soldier but as a musician and thus a noncombatant. Unless he was light skinned enough such that it could not be discerned and no one know his parental lineage, could Jackson have mustered in as a private instead? There were blacks who did but once discovered (unless the unit was in collusion), were mustered out.

[Battalion]

Originally Posted by gary

I don't know whether the James H. Jackson, a colored man who was mustered in as a musician was either a slave or a free man. I will say that he wasn't viewed by the Confederates as a soldier but as a musician and thus a noncombatant.

No. On his discharge paper he is called a soldier.

Originally Posted by gary

Unless he was light skinned enough such that it could not be discerned and no one know his parental lineage, could Jackson have mustered in as a private instead?

He was not passing as white. At least one of the rolls describes him as "colored."

Originally Posted by gary

There were blacks who did but once discovered (unless the unit was in collusion), were mustered out.

What about these?-

Arthur Reed, Company D, 3rd North Carolina Artillery
Muster Roll for July & August 1864:
...Enlisted as Private June 16, 1864.
...Described on roll as "Free Negro."
*Muster Roll for Sept. & October 1864:
...Described as "Free Negro."

Miles Reed, Company D, 3rd North Carolina Artillery
Muster Roll for July & August 1864:
...Enlisted as Private May 26, 1864.
...Described on roll as "Free Negro."
*Muster Roll for Sept. & October 1864:
...Described as "Free Negro."

*Last existing roll for Company D.

Neither were 'passing' as white.
Neither were discharged for being black.

~


Also what about the 15,000 American Indians who were in the Confederate army?

How did they slip past regulations?

[gary]

So Jackson was discharged as a "soldier." What was he before he was discharged? Examine his muster cards for his term of service. See if it consistently says musician at tell me at what point in time he was changed to soldier. I've found one colored fellow who was a cook but only after he deserted, was listed as a private.

As for the Indians, they were accepted into Confederate service. So were Cubans, Chinese, Filipinos and I believe there is an Arab (or some Middle Easterner) in Confederate ranks (but I can't name any of them). The Confederacy accepted men so long as they weren't of African heritage. I admit some did slip in (as discussed above), but on the whole, blacks weren't accepted as soldiers until the very end.

[cw1865]

Originally Posted by Battalion

Also what about the 15,000 American Indians who were in the Confederate army?

How did they slip past regulations?

Actualy Battalion you are touching on an often overlooked part of the Civil War (there is a 'third side' so to speak....perhaps you can provide some insight as to why the Cherokee supported one side over the other when it would seem that the Cherokee shouldn't care....

[Battalion]

Originally Posted by gary

So Jackson was discharged as a "soldier." What was he before he was discharged? Examine his muster cards for his term of service. See if it consistently says musician at tell me at what point in time he was changed to soldier. I've found one colored fellow who was a cook but only after he deserted, was listed as a private.

Two soldiers:

John Anderson
Company E, 4th US Colored Cavalry (Union)
Mustered-in as Bugler 31 December 1863.
Part of African American Civil War Memorial.
Included in the "180,000."

James H. Jackson
Company C, 2nd North Carolina Artillery Regiment (Confederate)
Mustered-in as Bugler 15 August 1861
Described on roll as "colored."

ancestry.com

Originally Posted by gary

As for the Indians, they were accepted into Confederate service. So were Cubans, Chinese, Filipinos....The Confederacy accepted men so long as they weren't of African heritage.

The regulations say 'white males.'

Indians, &etc, are not white.

[gary]

Originally Posted by Battalion

Two soldiers:

John Anderson
Company E, 4th US Colored Cavalry (Union)
Mustered-in as Bugler 31 December 1863.
Part of African American Civil War Memorial.
Included in the "180,000."

James H. Jackson
Company C, 2nd North Carolina Artillery Regiment (Confederate)
Mustered-in as Bugler 15 August 1861
Described on roll as "colored."

ancestry.com

The regulations say 'white males.'

Indians, &etc, are not white.

Sorry, but John Anderson doesn't count. He's in the Union Army and the subject is the Confederacy and black soldiers. As for James Jackson, we've gone over him already. Now, as to the other races, the Confederacy took them in. There's no dispute arising out of them. It was blacks that the Confederacy had a prejudice against as soldiers. Certainly some fell through the cracks, but those exceptions do not make a rule.

Suggest you read Bruce Levine's article in the March 2008 issue (V 10, N 5) of North & South magazine.