Confederate Flag Controversy

[cedarstripper]

Originally Posted by ronmcc4

Unfortunately, the stars and bars have become more a redneck symbol than anything else to most people. ......... I just want to honor my ancestors and the thousands like him who were in the War.

What is your opinion of flying the battleflag over a state capitol building or public school?

[bill_torrens]

A foreigner’s opinion on this subject is perhaps impertinent. But the hijacking of flags by political extremists is a subject on which I can offer a fresh perspective.

Both the Union Jack and the Cross of St. George have been used by a range of unsavoury groups of the shaven-headed, racial supremacist, Sieg Heil variety. And there are people in this country who now dislike the sight of either piece of bunting (even though the former is the national flag) because of an association of ideas. The point is this: what matters is what each flag really stands for, not which flaky group chooses to posture wrapped in its folds.

My personal view is that it is not inherently absurd for a Confederate flag to fly over the S.C. capitol building because some of the ideals of the people who designed that flag are still considered important by some present day Americans. Some of the ideals of the people who designed the flag are now repugnant, but that is equally true of the people who designed the Stars & Stripes, isn’t it? And the vast majority of American slaves lived under the Stars & Stripes.

My outsider’s perspective is that an increasingly ugly intolerance marks the flag debate in America. Is the banning and burning of flags really any better than the banning and burning of books? Once you start those bonfires you’ll find it hard to put them out.

[ronmcc4]

Good points Bill - no matter where they come from!

I don't have any problem with a Confederate flag (certainly not any of the 3 national flags) flying from a state capitol. Certainly it should fly below the Stars and Stripes to show it is appropriately subserviant to that flag.

As you know, many states, including my own home state of Alabama has a state flag that incorporates features of one of the Confederate flags. That's what the big flap was in Mississippi a while back. Their flag is based on the second national flag but has what most folks recognize as the battle flag in it.

[dawna]

I've tried to stay out of this conversation because, like Bill, my opinions are based on a foreigner's perspective, and in this instance, I may be crossing the line of good fellowship with my neighbours to the South. And I have also posted my feelings in the past regarding 'this great Southern eraser' whose sole intent is to destroy every last Confederate symbol, in one politically correct, fell swoop. I have to admit that this issue makes me so angry that it's difficult for me to remain objective and yet I simply can't ignore this.

My beliefs and concerns regarding the Confederate flag controversy are exactly the same as Bills, and I have very strong feelings with respect to censorship. Thousands of men, women, and children died under the Confederate Flag, and it's original intent meant something to these people, as it does to their ancestors, and anyone else who has the least amount of respect for the Southern cause. To convolute a symbol in this way is totally unacceptable and it saddens me to think that we have become so jaded and one-dimensional by all of this political double speak, that the "C" word now equals "Redneck." And a Redneck seems to be anyone who believes in the Confederacy. I would venture to say then that the term "redneck" has become an international conundrum.

It's just as well that I don't live in the South because I'd be plastering my house in Confederate symbolisms and whistling "Dixie" every chance I got. I don't fancy being told what I can read...or being held hostage for what I believe in.

Dawna

[8thvacav]

Well said dawna. I wish I could put my thoughts to words as well as you. I went to MOC two years ago for a private viewing of the 8th Va. Cav. flag that my gg grandfather and four uncles fought under. Not one time did I think of slavery. My wife and I both teared up looking at it. People today are so easy affended. I think many don't care one way or the other till a bunch of Unionest get them stirred up. Live and let live, I say.
8thvacav

[william42]

I am disappointed whenever I hear that a southern state has changed its flag to minimize or eliminate altogether any reference to its former status as a member of the Confederacy. When they do that, they're disavowing their sacred heritage, and trying to lessen the importance of the sacrifices made by their brave boys. The Confederate symbol incorporated in the state flag needs to be there as it always has been, not removed, or minimized,or changed, not for "politcal correctness" or for any other reason. If someone is offended by that state's heritage, then they should not visit that state. If a resident is offended by their state's heritage, then they should leave the state. But don't change the flag! It's wrong to do that and it gives the impression that the state is ashamed of its past, and that's wrong too.
....Terry

[william42]

Dawna, BTW, I responded to your message this morning concerning your attempt to diagnose your pc problem. You haven't read it yet according to the read receipt. Just wanted to give you a heads-up on that in case you didn't receive it.....Terry

[yankeewoman]

Just one eensy, teensy difference with some of you good folks........ the Confederate battle flag is known as the "southern cross". It is NOT the "stars and bars". "Stars and bars" was a flag of the Confederacy characterized by a circle of stars in a field of blue with three wide red stripes and a wide white stripe.

The most meaningful southern flag I have ever seen was displayed at Jackson's Winchester house. It was handspun and handwoven, probably at home, and had plant dyes used for color. There was so much love (and work) interwoven with the fibers used in that flag. I wonder if the man who carried it ever made it back......?

The flag controversery only seems to be carried on if there is an opportunity for publicity. The flag which seems to cause the most controversy is the southern cross which, I believe, is incorporated into several state flags. One of those same state flags hangs in the National Cathedral in Washington, DC. Another hangs from the rafters of the Farm Show Complex in Harrisburg, PA. I've never heard anyone complain. Hey..... it was a flag that mattered to someone! It was/IS a part of history. OUR history. Deal with it.

Let someone tell me that I cannot fly the flag of my choice. I am a Yankee ...... I will fly the flag that I wish to fly. Others be d_ _ ned!

*stepping down off the soapbox*

[ole]

Good posts:
Avoiding this flag or the other is a PC denial of an honorable heritage and the worst form of cowardice. Fly it and be proud of what it represents, but fly it below the stars and stripes. A curse on PC reactionaries!

[unionblue]

Well. here goes,

The Confederate Battle Flag is a part of our history and in no way should be completely destroyed or hidden or taken out of our culture. Many is the time I have taken a Confederate Battle flag into the classroom to explain it's use on the battlefield or use as a rallying symbol or point for a regiment in battle. I have shown other examples of Confederate flags, the Stars and Bars, the Hardee Flag and others to show the difference between them all.

I have carried the Confederate Battle Flag in parades at local reenactments and Civil War presentations and been proud to fire a salute to it over the graves of brave Southern men in the Camp Chase cemetary in Columbus, Ohio.

That being said, the flag needs to be preserved as part of our history, in museums and other historical sites and should be flown over the graves of those who fought for it, as it can do no harm in either place.

But like it or not, the flag was, as Shelby Foote notes, was 'captured' by hate groups and has come to represent some bad things here in this time. That capture needs to be disputed by Confederate heritage groups today, much like the efforts of the 37th Texas, who in full Confederate uniform, with Confederate Battle Flag held high, came to attention and did an about face when the KKK marched through a town in Texas carrying the same Confederate Battle Flag in their hate-filled march. You can imagine how upset the Klan was at such an act, that Southern men who wanted nothing more than the heritage of their Confederate ancestors honored, turned their backs on hate and stupidity.

The Confederate flag does not belong on top of a State building nor on the uniform of law enforcement. The flag of the United States belongs there and it should mean it is there to represent all Americans of whatever faith or creed or race.

Sincerely,
Unionblue