Civil War History - The Eastern TheaterDiscuss any and all battles, movements, and events occuring in the Eastern Theater here! This includes any actions in tha area east of the Appalachian Mountains in the vicinity of the river capitals of Richmond and Washington D.C.
It's a constant mystery to me how E. P. Alexander, whose judgements I usually prize, could call Otis Howard "an excellent officer".
I would say that it is because it is because Howard was a good officer in all actuality. One must remember that Lee, Jackson, Grant, and Sherman all had their problems. Lee was Ol' Granny, Jackson was inconsistent during the Seven Days, Grant was called a drunk (though he rarely touched the stuff during the war, b/c he couldn't hold his liquor) and Sherman was insane. Yet now, these men hold a place near and dear to the hearts of those on each side.
Howard was a good officer, who showed skill and prowess early in the war. He had a spate of bad luck during Chancellorsville, where he did not enforce protocol and make his division commanders put out pickets, an oversight he would live to regret. However, he placed men on the best ground during Gettysburg, and he went on the become the commander of the Army of the Tennessee, earning high praise from General Sherman (who was over his nervous breakdown by this point, lol) and earned the trust of an army that was commanded by Grant himself. He was a good officer, but like most officers of the war, he made his mistakes. Grant let himself get surprised; it just so happened that his men didn't all run at the first sight of rebels; a good deal of them stayed to fight. Howard's men did not like him; being predominantly of German descent, they had originally been under Franz Sigel, and were proud to say "I fights mit Sigel." Howard gets the corps and they were a bit disgruntled. Not the kind of men that you want to have under you command.
Howard is much maligned, but the only thing any body looks at is Chancellorsville and Gettysburg, and when it comes to the latter, they just look at his corps once more running, having been led to bad ground. They fail to look at his pre-11th Corps days and post-11th Corps days. He is maligned for a few mistakes, which, only being human, he was bound to make once and awhile. But, if he had not put men on Cemetery Hill, the battle may have turned out a heckuva lot different that in did.
Just some food for thought.
__________________ "The unity of government which constitutes you one people is also now dear to you. It is justly so, for it is a main pillar in the edifice of your real independence, the support of your tranquility at home, your peace abroad; of your safety; of your prosperity; of that very liberty which you so highly prize." George Washington, Farewell Address, 1796
looks at is Chancellorsville and Gettysburg, and when it comes to the latter, they just look at his corps once more running, having been led to bad ground. They fail to look at his pre-11th Corps days and post-11th Corps days.
Yes, but the thread is worst corps commander in 1863....You may as well ask, Was Howard the worst corps commander in 1863?
Yes, but the thread is worst corps commander in 1863....You may as well ask, Was Howard the worst corps commander in 1863?
In my list of worst of 1863, as I have said before, it was Sickles. He gets my vote. Howard took the good ground at Gettysburg, though there were tactical errors made by his men, he wasn't the corps commander at this point; he had taken command of the field. Carl Schurz was the commander during July 1st, and Howard tasked him with holding off Ewell. Schurz is probably more to blame for bad troop deployment than Howard was.
I am not even sure if he is in my top five for worst of 1863. He made mistakes at Chancellorsville, so he could be termed the worst for that battle. But there was only one other major battle in the eastern theater and that was Gettysburg, and while he didn't earn the glory that Hancock, Chamberlain and others got, he was no where near the worst on the field. He was fighting odds on July 1st that were beyond his capacity to continually resist. He had two Corps, one, the 1st, being fairly well used up (and, incidentally, disbanded and merged with the 5th after Gettysburg) and his 11th, who weren't the greatest of fighters. He was fighting two veteran Confederate corp that had more men than he, and reinforcements, though coming for him, wouldn't arrive for several more hours. In my opinion, he did an admirable job holding on as long as he did, and holding Cemetery Hill and Culps Hill for the rest of the AoP.
I dont' know the context that E.P. Alexander was using, if he was talking about Howard at Gettysburg, or Howard in general, but he had his opinion, and I tend to agree with it.
__________________ "The unity of government which constitutes you one people is also now dear to you. It is justly so, for it is a main pillar in the edifice of your real independence, the support of your tranquility at home, your peace abroad; of your safety; of your prosperity; of that very liberty which you so highly prize." George Washington, Farewell Address, 1796
In my list of worst of 1863, as I have said before, it was Sickles. He gets my vote.
Are you picking on my main man, Sickles?
Howard was career military. He has no excuses.
Sickles was, well, Dan Sickles.....you can't get mad at a dog for being a dog.
Sickles did ok at Chancellorsville, Gettysburg, we've previously discussed. I support Sickles move into the Peach Orchard, Ole hates the move (hates Sickles too I might add )
I don't like Howard at Chancellorsville and I am not crazy about him at Gettysburg either.
Ole hates the move (hates Sickles too I might add )
Now that is just not fair! Ole don't hate nobody. Aside from being a bloody fool on that Second Day, he had some admirable characteristics. (Give me time, I will think of one.) How about: He gives us a lot of meat to discuss?
This thread is most interesting. I haven't decided yet who was the worst in that particular year. Howard certainly had his bad moments, and (just perhaps) history has treated him badly. Chancellorsville was certainly not his finest hour. And I haven't been totally convinced by either side that Sickles was the worst in 1863.
Have we considered McClernand? Or Polk? Take it west. Will take that back. The thread lies under the Eastern Theater. Ignore the suggestion.
ole
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
I have a question. If Howard was such a horrible corps commander, why was he kept on until the very end of the war?
Its amazing they didn't sack him to be honest with you. He redeems himself later under Sherman as far as I am concerned. Nevertheless, a shaky 1863 for Howard
i'll go with Howard at Chancellorsville. always be on guard. Jackson ran all over his corps, scattering them everywhere. if Howard would've put more interest in the war, than he wouldn't have gotten run over.
i'd replace him with Meager or someone. but i heard that Howard wasn't with his Corp when that happebned. anyway, big blow to his rep back at home.
Confrontation of Howard and Jackson seems particularly interesting because of well known religiousness of both generals.
Please excuse me if it is a silly question, but I'm just curious if Mr Oliver's problems with German troops had something to do with religion? After all many Dutchmen were atheists.
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