Civil War History - The Eastern TheaterDiscuss any and all battles, movements, and events occuring in the Eastern Theater here! This includes any actions in tha area east of the Appalachian Mountains in the vicinity of the river capitals of Richmond and Washington D.C.
Lee could win resounding victories but aside from Second Manassas he never exploited those victories to his advantage. He just wasted precious manpower in the process.
Lee couldn't think beyond Virginia and Jeff Davis managed the west horribly.
I agree with this and the last 3 or 4 most recent posts. Davis' mismanagement (micro-management?) of the West must be one of the most egregious errors of the South.
Johnston's strategic retreat was quite understandable considering the forces opposing him.
Would he have been more successful than Hood at the gates of Atlanta? Who knows, but I can't see him venturing on a suicidal advance toward Nashville ala Mr. Hood.
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"It was a very peculiar time." - Franklin D. Cossitt
Ancestors in USA Army: 6th IA Inf, 11th IL Cav, 1st AL Cav; 122nd NY Inf; 6th MI Cav; 35th MA Inf; 100th IL Inf; 1st CO Inf/Cav; 22nd IN Inf
Sam, the advance wasn't actually all that suicidal aside from the timing with the weather. There were chances such as at Spring Hill in November on the way north from Columbia toward Franklin when Schofield's army could have easily been beaten. Yes, there were several thousand fresh Union troops in Nashville ready to defend, but that could have been a contest if Gen. Hood had not been a bit crazy at Franklin. Sending 18,000 men across an open field into an fortified enemy in the dark could have been second-guessed (and has been many times) as stupidity or drug-enchanced vengance. Otherwise Hood, with a little help from Beaugregard who was calling the shots, was more or less on top of his game. He sent Forrest to tear up the Nashville-Chattanooga railroad, the main Federal supply line to Sherman and also arranged for the retreat into Alabama in advance. Much like a basketball game, a good plan won't make up for sloppy court play. A fresher Confederate force could have made the struggle for Nashville a contest.
Cutting Sherman's primary line of communications should have worked. Whoda' thunk Sherman would depart from conventional and simply say, "Who cares?"
One cannot anticipate an opponent stepping outside the box. Well, I guess you can, but then you'd be pulling a "Little Mac" and use up crucial time speculating.
Your basketball analogy brought back memories. Our coach used the rule book imaginatively until the word got around. The book said something like "The ball must be returned to play from outside the sideline." It didn't specify an exact point. He'd set up receivers and the one returning the ball would run a few yards, [i]outside[i] the sideline and pass it in. Confused the bejeezus out of the opposition for a while.
As usual, Larry, excellent observations.
Ole
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
Hood went for Nashville because he thought it would draw Sherman off of his march. Sherman didn't go for it. He either thought Hood's army was too decimated after his foolishness of rash attacks, or he had faith in "Pap" Thomas to handle Hood. Considering that Grant didn't like/trust Thomas and Sherman was Grant's lapdog I would suspect that Sherman simply believed that Hood's AOT was not a big threat to the Union's holdings in Tennessee. Had Hood seen to the supply of his men and not used them as he did (moronically in my opinion) things might have turned out different in Tennessee. But then again we are talking about Thomas....steady, reliable and a tough nut to crack.
Calicoboy
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My dear mother:- I have come safely through two more terrible engagements with the enemy, that at South Mountain and the great battle of yesterday (Antietam). Our splendid regiment is almost destroyed. We have had nearly 400 men killed and wounded in the battles. Seven of our officers were shot and three killed in yesterday's battle and nearly 150 men killed and wounded. All from less than 300 engaged. The men have stood like iron....Maj. Rufus Dawes, 6th Wisconsin Volunteers
Sam, the advance wasn't actually all that suicidal aside from the timing with the weather. There were chances such as at Spring Hill in November on the way north from Columbia toward Franklin when Schofield's army could have easily been beaten. Yes, there were several thousand fresh Union troops in Nashville ready to defend, but that could have been a contest if Gen. Hood had not been a bit crazy at Franklin. Sending 18,000 men across an open field into an fortified enemy in the dark could have been second-guessed (and has been many times) as stupidity or drug-enchanced vengance. Otherwise Hood, with a little help from Beaugregard who was calling the shots, was more or less on top of his game. He sent Forrest to tear up the Nashville-Chattanooga railroad, the main Federal supply line to Sherman and also arranged for the retreat into Alabama in advance. Much like a basketball game, a good plan won't make up for sloppy court play. A fresher Confederate force could have made the struggle for Nashville a contest.
"wasn't actually all that suicidal"
I think the outcome shows that it was very suicidal. The weather was the same for both sides, and apparently only delayed Thomas' destruction of Hood's army.
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"It was a very peculiar time." - Franklin D. Cossitt
Ancestors in USA Army: 6th IA Inf, 11th IL Cav, 1st AL Cav; 122nd NY Inf; 6th MI Cav; 35th MA Inf; 100th IL Inf; 1st CO Inf/Cav; 22nd IN Inf
Happy new year Sam! The weather wasn't so big a deal for the yanks who were already in Nashville. Schofield's army was a bit cool and wet having been chased north by Hood's boys. Thomas had plently of fresh troops in Nashville. The weather, bad as it was on the retreat, probably saved a bunch of Confederate lives because the pursuit was slowed considerably. I'm afraid suicidal ain't a bad word to describe the overall result as you suggest. Enough of this army (Confederate) survived, thanks mostly to Walthall and Forrest, to fight again in North Carolina. Just as the removal of Johnston earlier from command, a waste of good manpower which the South couldn't replace.
Grant wanted Thomas to attack Hood immediately....during the worst icestorm in many years. "Pap" was not to be intimidated. He waited for the weather to break before he set at Hood's decimated army. Grant had even dispatched Thomas' replacement who wisely turned back when hearing of Thomas' victory. This episode always reinforces my good opinion of Thomas. He worked from strong positions, never rushed and always considered the condition of his men. Traits of an excellent commander.
Calicoboy
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My dear mother:- I have come safely through two more terrible engagements with the enemy, that at South Mountain and the great battle of yesterday (Antietam). Our splendid regiment is almost destroyed. We have had nearly 400 men killed and wounded in the battles. Seven of our officers were shot and three killed in yesterday's battle and nearly 150 men killed and wounded. All from less than 300 engaged. The men have stood like iron....Maj. Rufus Dawes, 6th Wisconsin Volunteers
I have no particular problem with George H. Thomas either. Caution had a lot to be said for it both then and now. Thomas didn't exactly attack Hood as an offensive gesture. The CSA had Nashville surrounded when Thomas decided to turn the boys loose. Perhaps Thomas could have completely wiped out the Army of Tennessee with a little more pursuit at Lexington, Alabama rather than pulling back. My gg grandfather with the AOT I'm sure was thankful that he didn't. Capturing the Army of Tennessee might have saved a few hundred lives at Bentonville, but perhaps not much else.
I have no particular problem with George H. Thomas either. Caution had a lot to be said for it both then and now. Thomas didn't exactly attack Hood as an offensive gesture. The CSA had Nashville surrounded when Thomas decided to turn the boys loose. Perhaps Thomas could have completely wiped out the Army of Tennessee with a little more pursuit at Lexington, Alabama rather than pulling back. My gg grandfather with the AOT I'm sure was thankful that he didn't. Capturing the Army of Tennessee might have saved a few hundred lives at Bentonville, but perhaps not much else.
I really do not think that Thomas was feeling intimidated by the AoT at Nashville. The only reason Hood moved to Nashville is that he followed Schofield north...probably wondering why that Union general didn't finish him off at Franklin. Thomas was secure in Nashville and completely unthreatened. His men were well rested and well supplied. The Confederates "surrounding" Nashville were in desperate straights. The fact that Hood didn't withdraw to the south after Franklin shows that he just wasn't up to the moment. The AoT was the bravest set of men; but when one is beaten, starving and shivering in the cold without tents, food or real clothing one does not fight well.
Calicoboy
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My dear mother:- I have come safely through two more terrible engagements with the enemy, that at South Mountain and the great battle of yesterday (Antietam). Our splendid regiment is almost destroyed. We have had nearly 400 men killed and wounded in the battles. Seven of our officers were shot and three killed in yesterday's battle and nearly 150 men killed and wounded. All from less than 300 engaged. The men have stood like iron....Maj. Rufus Dawes, 6th Wisconsin Volunteers
I really do not think that Thomas was feeling intimidated by the AoT at Nashville. The only reason Hood moved to Nashville is that he followed Schofield north...probably wondering why that Union general didn't finish him off at Franklin. Thomas was secure in Nashville and completely unthreatened. His men were well rested and well supplied. The Confederates "surrounding" Nashville were in desperate straights. The fact that Hood didn't withdraw to the south after Franklin shows that he just wasn't up to the moment. The AoT was the bravest set of men; but when one is beaten, starving and shivering in the cold without tents, food or real clothing one does not fight well.
Calicoboy
You are correct that Hood followed Schofield to Nashville as a continuation (at least in Hood's mind) of his offensive thrust into Tennessee. Schofield had abandoned the field at Franklin, albeit after he left nearly 7,000 Confederate bodies on either side of Columbia Pike south of the Carter House. Federal casualties numbered nearly 3,000. The weather during the period November 28 to December 15 was extremely poor. Snow and sleet. The Confederates camped and rested except for Forrest and Bates who were sent to the Nashville- Chattanooga railroad from Nashville to La Vergne to Murfreesboro to capture blockhouses and tear up track. Nashville was 'secure' as you stated, but there was really no where else for Hood to go after Franklin but on north. Remember that Hood was in 'friendly' territory, even though Thomas' army had things and Nashville well in hand. Hood and most of his command was in the Brentwood area on the Davidson County line before advancing to the line of battle. Schofield was in no condition himself to 'finish Hood off at Franklin'. Hood still had a formidable, though frozen, force. Thomas would have been and was, a different story. Hood was in the deep 'mud'. He really had no choice except to go forward. The Duck river to the south was impassable and he had been ordered north by Beauregard who should receive considerable credit for the mess he created.
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