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The way I understand it, Unionblue, is that Davis and Stephens were appointed to the office by the people who were elected to serve in the Confederate Government. They were not electected by the people, but appointed by that particular body.
In a sense, they were elected by people elected to represent the people of the several states, but they were not subject to a real election of the people. No Charlestonian nor New Orleanian was asked who he wanted as president. The people they sent to represent them picked Davis and Stephens. They were not asked.
A couple of democratic steps skipped?
ole
Seems to me that this is comparable to Neil's position that all Confederate soldiers fought for slavery because they were in the Confederate army. I believe the Confederate legislature was created just as Ole had described, after the various states, in general election, voted on secession the last time. Exactly how it was created, I need clarifification as well (as you know I could use clarification on lots of stuff. Just keep Guido away, is all I ask.) My point, if I have one, is that the people of the Confederate states didn't vote to install these individuals in the Conf. congress and many of them, darned near half didn't vote for secession. Communication was p poor to say the least, so I suspect, just as today, many of these folks were clueless as to the details. Ole, does NFW mean the same thing up there as down here? Not to be confused with VFW? (I sense you have slipped one past the little turkey sensor, no small feat; two points for you!)
__________________ Ancestors in US Army: 13th TN Cav; 10th TN Cav; 3rd NC Inf
Ancestors in CSA Army: 48th VA; 63rd VA, 5th NC Cav; 37th NC
Wife and Grandson's CSA: 15th AL, 51st GA, 41st TN; 36th TN; GA Mil 1197 Dist
According to Wikipedia, the President of the Confederacy was elected by an electoral college like the U.S. one. Remember that in the U.S. it's up to the states how to cast the electoral vote. Although it's universal today to have a popular vote, and near-universal (Maine and Nebraska are exceptions) to have the winner take the entire electoral vote of a given state, that wasn't the case then. Through 1860, South Carolina was having its legislature rather than its population decide how its electoral vote was to be cast, so there was no popular vote there, and other states had done it that way at earlier periods, so an electoral college doesn't imply that there was a popular election; it also doesn't imply that every state did it the same way. Perhaps they functioned according to the same rules as in 1860.
All that said, I did find on Wikipedia (in a mostly-unsuccessful hunt for details which would have spared me all those perhapses above) a sample ballot from Virginia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:C...iaNov61861.jpg
The people mentioned below Stephens must have been the members of the electoral college. And even though they're presented as representing the house districts, they're all there, so I'd guess the winner-take-all system was in effect in Virginia, as it had been (in Virginia) in the U.S. election the previous year.
Also (and still making suppositions here...) while there's only one slate of candidates, the footnotes indicate this is an actual cast ballot, as opposed to the sort of sample ballots/voting guides handed out by parties at polling places, so I guess that slate was unopposed.
Last edited by Michael19103; 08-17-2008 at 10:28 AM.
Michael, thanks for your reply and the thoughtful research! A man with your level of logic will be an asset to this conglomeration of civil war enthusiasts. Welcome aboard!
__________________ Ancestors in US Army: 13th TN Cav; 10th TN Cav; 3rd NC Inf
Ancestors in CSA Army: 48th VA; 63rd VA, 5th NC Cav; 37th NC
Wife and Grandson's CSA: 15th AL, 51st GA, 41st TN; 36th TN; GA Mil 1197 Dist
A truly interesting find, Michael. To further cloud the issue, I note that the date is November, 1861. Davis had already been provisional president and then president for some months. Did Virginia, which didn't get into the provisional phase, hold some kind of confirmation election of its own?
It would be interesting to find a ballot with a list of other candidates.
ole
__________________ I never knew a man who wished to be himself a slave. Consider if you know any good thing that no man desires for himself. A. Lincoln
The CW Center has a statue of Lincoln and Tad memorializing their visit to Richmond after its capture by Union forces in 1865, at which time they were welcomed by Richmond's black residents. That statue was criticized by some who characterize Lincoln as a conqueror.
The Davis statue which includes a figure representing Jim Limber, an African American, the message being that Davis was cool with black people, regardless of the slavery thing. I've read that the Davis statue would "balance" the museum, one bookend Lincoln, the other Davis.
However, if the SCV did not insist on conditions about display, how the statue is interpreted, displayed, or if it would be displayed at all, it apparently up to the museum staff.
I've never been to this museum. Is it worth a visit?
No, Ole, that was the "nation"-wide election held in November 1861. They elected house members as well, and reelected the house in November 1863 (except in places like New Orleans and Vicksburg). Copied the U.S. in this respect except they went onto an odd-year cycle. If you start with the Wikipedia article "Confederate States of America" you can quickly get into all sorts of stuff (and, in my instance this morning, end up completely zoning on Meet the Press....)
I guess the intent in establishing a normal election cycle was to have something more legitimate than the quickie provisional stuff done during the winter/spring secession-and-confederating phase. So the bottom line is Davis was elected twice, provisionally in February then permanently in November.
By the way, as for the fusion-tickets-in-1860 question I posed in the politics-and-secession forum, Wikipedia gave me the best explanation of that I've ever seen, complete with state-by-state popular vote numbers. I know Wiki's sometimes controversial, but for basic factual stuff, it's unbeatable.
Last edited by Michael19103; 08-17-2008 at 12:52 PM.
When did the National Park Service cede Tredegar Iron Works and Belle Isle to the Civil War Center in Richmond? I went to their website and saw photos of Tredegar. The last time I went (about two years ago) it was still National Park turf.
The way I understand it, Unionblue, is that Davis and Stephens were appointed to the office by the people who were elected to serve in the Confederate Government. They were not electected by the people, but appointed by that particular body.
In a sense, they were elected by people elected to represent the people of the several states, but they were not subject to a real election of the people. No Charlestonian nor New Orleanian was asked who he wanted as president. The people they sent to represent them picked Davis and Stephens. They were not asked.
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